login
Hints
(Greetings from The On-Line Encyclopedia of Bongard Problems!)
Search: -meta:BP508
Displaying 11-20 of 27 results found. ( prev | next )     page 1 2 3
     Sort: id      Format: long      Filter: (all | no meta | meta)      Mode: (words | no words)
BP393 Correct vs. incorrect.
(edit; present; nest [left/right]; search; history)
COMMENTS

"True" vs. "false."

CROSSREFS

Adjacent-numbered pages:
BP388 BP389 BP390 BP391 BP392  *  BP394 BP395 BP396 BP397 BP398

KEYWORD

nice, fuzzy, abstract, collective, contributepairs, traditional, rules, miniworlds, dithering

CONCEPT categorization (info | search),
true_false (info | search)

AUTHOR

Jago Collins

BP505 Number indicated on number line conceptually related to image shown below vs. not so.
(edit; present; nest [left/right]; search; history)
COMMENTS

This is the "easier version" of BP801.


All numbers on the left are canonical mathematical constants, i.e. there are no totally arbitrary ratios, with images below featuring those ratios.

CROSSREFS

Adjacent-numbered pages:
BP500 BP501 BP502 BP503 BP504  *  BP506 BP507 BP508 BP509 BP510

KEYWORD

fuzzy, math

CONCEPT number (info | search),
ratio (info | search)

AUTHOR

Aaron David Fairbanks

BP508 Bongard Problems with precise definitions vs. Bongard Problems with vague definitions.
BP1
BP3
BP4
BP6
BP13
BP23
BP31
BP67
BP72
BP103
BP104
BP210
BP292
BP312
BP321
BP322
BP324
BP325
BP329
BP334
BP344
BP348
BP367
BP368
BP376
BP384
BP386
BP389
BP390
BP391
BP523
BP527
BP557
BP558
BP559

. . .

BP2
BP9
BP10
BP11
BP12
BP14
BP62
BP119
BP148
BP364
BP393
BP505
BP508
BP509
BP511
BP524
BP571
BP812
BP813
BP847
BP865
BP894
BP895
BP939
BP1002
BP1111
BP1158
(edit; present; nest [left/right]; search; history)
COMMENTS

Bongard Problems sorted left have the keyword "precise" on the OEBP.

Bongard Problems sorted right have the keyword "fuzzy" on the OEBP.


In an precise Bongard Problem, any relevant example is either clearly sorted left, clearly sorted right, or clearly not sorted.

(All relevant examples clearly sorted either left or right is the keyword allsorted.)


How can it be decided whether or not a rule is precise? How can it be decided whether or not a rule classifies all "examples that are relevant"? There needs to be another rule to determine which examples the original rule intends to sort. Bongard Problems by design communicate ideas without fixing that context ahead of time. The label "precise" can only mean a Bongard Problem's rule seems precise to people who see it. (This "precise vs. fuzzy" Bongard Problem is fuzzy.)


In an precise "less than ___ vs. greater than ___" Bongard Problem (keyword spectrum), the division between the sides is usually an apparent threshold. For example, there is an intuitive threshold between acute and obtuse angles (see e.g. BP292).


As a rule of thumb, do not consider imperfections of hand drawn images (keyword ignoreimperfections) when deciding whether a Bongard Problem is precise or fuzzy. Just because one can draw a square badly does not mean "triangle vs. quadrilateral" (BP6) should be labelled fuzzy; similar vagueness arises in all hand-drawn Bongard Problems. (For Bongard Problems in which fine subtleties of drawings, including small imperfections, are meant to be considered, use the keyword perfect.)


Sometimes the way a Bongard Problem would sort certain examples is an unsolved problem in mathematics. (See e.g. BP820.) There is a precise criterion that has been used to verify each sorted example fits where it fits (some kind of mathematical proof); however, where some examples fit is still unknown. Whether or not such a Bongard Problem should be labelled "precise" might be debated.

(Technical note: some properties are known to be undecidable, and sometimes the decidability itself is unknown. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decision_problem .)

(See the keyword proofsrequired.)

One way to resolve this ambiguity is to define "precise" as meaning that once people decide where an example belongs for a reason, they will all agree about it.


Sometimes the class of all examples in a Bongard Problem is imprecise, but, despite that, the rule sorting those examples is precise. Say, for some potential new example, it is unclear whether it should be included in the Bongard Problem at all, but, if it were included, it would be clear where it should be sorted (or that it should be left unsorted). A Bongard Problem like this can still be tagged "precise".

(If all examples are clearly sorted except for some example for which it is unclear whether it belongs to the class of relevant examples, the situation becomes ambiguous.)

On the other hand, sometimes the class of all examples is very clear, with an obvious boundary. (Keyword preciseworld.)


There is a subtle distinction to draw between Bongard Problems that are precise to the people making them and Bongard Problems that are precise to the people solving them. A Bongard Problem (particularly a non-allsorted one) might be labeled "precise" on the OEBP because the description and the listed ambiguous examples explicitly forbid sorting certain border cases; however, someone looking at the Bongard Problem without access to the OEBP page containing the definition would not be aware of this. It may or may not be obvious that certain examples were intentionally left out of the Bongard Problem. A larger collection of examples may make it more clear that a particularly blatant potential border case was left out intentionally.

CROSSREFS

See BP876 for the version with pictures of Bongard Problems instead of links to pages on the OEBP.

See both and neither for specific ways an example can be classified as unsorted in an "precise" Bongard Problem.

Adjacent-numbered pages:
BP503 BP504 BP505 BP506 BP507  *  BP509 BP510 BP511 BP512 BP513

KEYWORD

fuzzy, meta (see left/right), links, keyword, right-self, sideless

WORLD

bp [smaller | same | bigger]

AUTHOR

Aaron David Fairbanks

BP509 Bongard Problems that sort all relevant examples vs. Bongard Problems that would leave some unsorted.
BP1
BP3
BP31
BP103
BP312
BP321
BP322
BP329
BP334
BP376
BP384
BP386
BP389
BP390
BP527
BP557
BP559
BP560
BP564
BP569
BP576
BP788
BP820
BP856
BP863
BP891
BP897
BP898
BP905
BP922
BP934
BP935
BP937
BP945
BP949

. . .

BP292
BP508
BP509
BP961
BP1073
BP1208
(edit; present; nest [left/right]; search; history)
COMMENTS

Left-sorted Bongard Problems have the keyword "allsorted" on the OEBP.


A Bongard Problem is labelled "allsorted" when the type of thing it sorts is partitioned unambiguously and without exception into two groups.


Similarly to using the precise and fuzzy keywords, calling a Bongard Problem "allsorted" is a subjective/intuitive judgment. The collection of all relevant potential examples is not clearly delineated anywhere.

(Sometimes it's ambiguous whether to consider certain examples that are ambiguously sorted relevant.)


The solution to an "allsorted" Bongard Problem can usually be re-phrased as "___ vs. not so" (see the keyword notso).

But not every "___ vs. not so" Bongard Problem should be labelled "allsorted"; there could be ambiguous border cases in a "___ vs. not so" Bongard Problem.


Bongard Problems in which the two sides are so different that there is no middle ground between them (keyword gap) are sometimes still labelled "allsorted", since the intuitive pool of all relevant examples just amounts to the two unrelated sides. But some "gap" Bongard Problems are not like that; for example sometimes there are more related classes of examples besides the two shown.


Sometimes the class of all examples in a Bongard Problem is imprecise, but, despite that, the rule sorting those examples is precise. Say, for some potential new example, it is unclear whether it should be included in the Bongard Problem at all, but, if it were included, it would be clear where it should be sorted. A Bongard Problem like this can still be tagged "allsorted".

On the other hand, sometimes the class of all examples is very clear, with an obvious boundary. (Keyword preciseworld.)



In deciding where to sort an example, we think about it until we come to a conclusion; an example isn't here considered ambiguous just because someone might have a hard time with it (keyword hardsort).

However, sometimes the way a Bongard Problem would sort certain examples is an unsolved problem in mathematics, and it may be unknown whether there is even a solution. Whether or not such a Bongard Problem should be labelled "allsorted" might be debated.

(See the keyword proofsrequired.)

One way to resolve this ambiguity is to redefine "allsorted" as meaning that once people decide where an example belongs, it will be on one of the two sides, and they will all agree about it.



There is a distinction to be made between a non-"allsorted" Bongard Problem that could be made "allsorted" by making (finitely many) more examples sorted (thereby modifying or clarifying the solution of the Bongard Problem) and one such that this is not possible while maintaining a comparably simple solution. The former kind would often be labelled precise, in particular when these border cases have been explicitly forbidden from being sorted in the Bongard Problem's definition.

For instance, discrete Bongard Problems that are not allsorted usually fall into the former category.

CROSSREFS

See BP875 for the version with pictures of Bongard Problems instead of links to pages on the OEBP.

"Allsorted" implies precise.

"Allsorted" and both are mutually exclusive.

"Allsorted" and neither are mutually exclusive.

Adjacent-numbered pages:
BP504 BP505 BP506 BP507 BP508  *  BP510 BP511 BP512 BP513 BP514

KEYWORD

fuzzy, meta (see left/right), links, keyword, right-self, sideless, right-it, feedback

WORLD

bp [smaller | same | bigger]

AUTHOR

Aaron David Fairbanks

BP511 Noisy Bongard Problems vs. minimalist Bongard Problems.
BP10
BP25
BP37
BP40
BP42
BP48
BP58
BP60
BP64
BP65
BP66
BP73
BP82
BP98
BP105
BP106
BP109
BP116
BP123
BP127
BP128
BP130
BP131
BP132
BP135
BP136
BP162
BP165
BP174
BP181
BP183
BP192
BP194
BP201
BP202

. . .

BP859
BP962
BP1104
BP1122
BP1156
BP1219
BP1255
(edit; present; nest [left/right]; search; history)
COMMENTS

Left-sorted BPs have the keyword "noisy" on the OEBP. Right-sorted examples have the keyword "minimal."


Noisy Bongard Problems include extra details varying between examples that distract from the solution property; more specifically noise is properties independent of the solution property that vary between examples. Minimalist Bongard Problems only vary details absolutely necessary to communicate the solution.


"Noisy" is different than the kind of distraction mentioned at distractingworld, which means the class of examples is distractingly specific, irrelevant to the solution, rather than that there are extra distracting properties changing between examples.


Bongard Problems have varying degrees of noisiness. Only include here BPs that are very noisy or very minimal.

CROSSREFS

See BP827 for the version with pictures of Bongard Problems (miniproblems) instead of links to pages on the OEBP.

See BP845 for noise in sequences of quantity increase.

Adjacent-numbered pages:
BP506 BP507 BP508 BP509 BP510  *  BP512 BP513 BP514 BP515 BP516

KEYWORD

fuzzy, meta (see left/right), links, keyword, sideless

WORLD

bp [smaller | same | bigger]

AUTHOR

Harry E. Foundalis, Aaron David Fairbanks

BP524 Same objects are shown lined up in both "universes" vs. the two "universes" are not aligned.
(edit; present; nest [left/right]; search; history)
COMMENTS

All examples are black and white images, partitioned by lines such that crossing a line switches the background color and the foreground color. (Sometimes it is not clear which is "background" and which is "foreground".) In the space between two dividing lines, there is a black and white scene; the outlines of the shapes are curves dividing black from white. Images sorted left are such that each outline-curve present in a scene that comes in contact non-tangentially with a dividing line continues across the dividing line, across which the black and white sides of it switch.


Examples (especially right) usually have ambiguity to some degree; depending on how a person reads the images, dividing lines may be confused for curves within a scene.

CROSSREFS

Adjacent-numbered pages:
BP519 BP520 BP521 BP522 BP523  *  BP525 BP526 BP527 BP528 BP529

KEYWORD

fuzzy, unwordable, anticomputer, traditional, blackwhiteinvariant

AUTHOR

Aaron David Fairbanks

BP571 Bongard Problems that require mathematical understanding to solve vs. other Bongard Problems.
BP171
BP203
BP319
BP326
BP327
BP333
BP334
BP335
BP339
BP340
BP341
BP344
BP369
BP370
BP378
BP380
BP381
BP382
BP384
BP505
BP560
BP562
BP563
BP569
BP576
BP788
BP790
BP791
BP797
BP801
BP806
BP809
BP810
BP811
BP813

. . .

(edit; present; nest [left/right]; search; history)
COMMENTS

Left examples have the keyword "math" on the OEBP.


Although everything is arguably related to math, these BP solutions include content that people don't inherently understand without learning at least some mathematics.


Left examples do not technically have "culturally-dependent" content (keyword culture), but knowledge and previous learning plays a role in how easy they are to solve.

CROSSREFS

Adjacent-numbered pages:
BP566 BP567 BP568 BP569 BP570  *  BP572 BP573 BP574 BP575 BP576

KEYWORD

fuzzy, meta (see left/right), links, keyword

WORLD

bp [smaller | same | bigger]

AUTHOR

Aaron David Fairbanks

BP812 Aesthetically pleasing vs. not so.
(edit; present; nest [left/right]; search; history)
CROSSREFS

Adjacent-numbered pages:
BP807 BP808 BP809 BP810 BP811  *  BP813 BP814 BP815 BP816 BP817

KEYWORD

easy, fuzzy, abstract, notso, stretch, anticomputer, subjective, invalid, experimental, funny, dithering

AUTHOR

Aaron David Fairbanks

BP813 Representations of natural mathematical objects vs. representations of arbitrary objects.
(edit; present; nest [left/right]; search; history)
COMMENTS

This is a very fuzzy definition. Some left examples arguably should be placed on the right, since the particular way they are represented is arbitrary--the Platonic solids EX6730 and primes EX6734 especially, as these show arbitrary placement and arrangement of objects. Furthermore if arbitrary representations are allowed one cannot be sure for example the right hand drawing of random numbers EX6740 does not represent "numbers" in general. Still this Bongard Problem has been solved by people.

CROSSREFS

Adjacent-numbered pages:
BP808 BP809 BP810 BP811 BP812  *  BP814 BP815 BP816 BP817 BP818

KEYWORD

fuzzy, abstract, stretch, math, solved, collective, experimental, dithering

AUTHOR

Aaron David Fairbanks

BP847 Evokes the idea of symmetry vs. not so.
(edit; present; nest [left/right]; search; history)
COMMENTS

Or, perhaps more concretely, "Depiction of object with some symmetry (invariance under transformation) vs. depiction of object with no simple symmetries."

CROSSREFS

Adjacent-numbered pages:
BP842 BP843 BP844 BP845 BP846  *  BP848 BP849 BP850 BP851 BP852

KEYWORD

nice, fuzzy, abstract, math, concept, collective, dithering

CONCEPT symmetry (info | search)

AUTHOR

Leo Crabbe

( prev | next )     page 1 2 3

Welcome | Solve | Browse | Lookup | Recent | Links | Register | Contact
Contribute | Keywords | Concepts | Worlds | Ambiguities | Transformations | Invalid Problems | Style Guide | Goals | Glossary